LINDER'S LOOK MAILBAG
By Doveed Linder
Doveed, your column [Canelo Is Mayweather's New Pacquiao] makes sense regarding Floyd Mayweather, but you make it seem like there's some vagueness there. The fact is, if you go back and look at the facts, he never wanted the fight with Manny Pacquaio (not to mention he missed a ton of other guys his whole career, but let's not get into that). At first he tried to dictate terms (that were very unorthodox at the time, and basically called a guy with a star that shined as big as him a "cheater"), and then a year later on more than one occasion, when Pac said ok, he's fine with testing up to the fight, Mayweather priced himself out of the fight, using the logic of "well his biggest payday was $XX, so why should he make much more?"...The bottom line is, you could turn the same logic with the money part against Floyd, as he's never made $100 mil for any fight so why should he now? Now if you notice, in interviews like the one in the Final 4 game, Floyd spins this and uses the old LIE that Pac didn't ever want to "take the tests". Besides all that, Floyd wasn't the A-side to Pac being the B, they were both on the same terms, with Pacquiao arguably being bigger at the time, if you look at it on a worldwide scale. But, hey, Pac took big risks in the ring and lost, while Floyd took the easy fights and still sits undefeated.
Could you imagine Floyd fighting a guy four times that gave him the toughest fight of his career? No way. Never. What I really want to know is how can you (and writers like you) sit there and still call Floyd the pound-for-pound king (even if it is by default), when he's missed so many guys?? How many guys has Andre Ward missed?? He's cleared out his division. Even the Klitschko brothers, have they missed anyone? I understand that pound-for-pound means to rate them as if they were all the same size, but have we seen Floyd with inferior or better opposition than Ward? What makes you think Floyd is better than Andre Ward, if Ward has been in with much better guys in the last 2 or 3 years? The Klitschkos, you really can't tell because they are so dominant, but still, I don't understand how this guy can sit up there and handpick his opposition, and still get called the P4P best. He's top 5, but no way #1. You guys in the press need to start asking yourselves the right questions about this guy. --Paul
Linder's Response: I agree with everything you say regarding the Pacquiao-Mayweather debate. Also, if you look at most of the interviews with Floyd from 2009-2012, when he was asked about the Pacquiao fight, he tip toed around the subject and became defensive. He didn't act like a guy who wanted the fight to happen. When I refer to Floyd as the #1 pound for pound fighter, I'm talking about the general public perception. On a personal note, I don't particularly like ranking fighters. In my view, it's impossible to create an accurate list. As a fan, I'm not really interested in Floyd. I respect his skills, but he's not the kind of fighter who brought me to boxing. I like fighters who respect the public and are interested in proving their ability and making the best fights possible - guys like Muhammad Ali, Sugar Ray Leonard, Evander Holyfield, and Oscar De La Hoya. I agree that Andre Ward, as well as the Klitschkos, should be praised for fighting and also dominating the best fighters in their division. They are what boxing is all about.
Great article on Floyd Mayweather. I think he would out smart Canelo Alvarez but Floyd does not want to have to dig deep like that. As for Canelo, a Sergio Martinez fight would be an ass-kicking for the Argentinian . Styles make fights. Lastly, I am a die hard Shane Mosley fan who hates to see this version. I watched a you tube video of him training in 2005 with John David Jackson. His pad work was lethal and explosive. Now when he trains, he has no pop. Even as a fan I wish he could take energy or growth supplements to rekindle. I know I am bad for saying that but this old man version hurts to watch. Give me the Mosley at 34 in 2006 which was still fast and hard punching!! Any way take care and keep up the great articles-- Aaron "Precise" Blount
Linder's Response: I too would definitely give Mayweather the edge against Alvarez, but Mayweather-Alvarez is a real fight. Mayweather hasn't fought a live dog like that in a long time. It's hard to say how his abilities have stood up over the years, because we haven't seen him in with an A level fighter who was in his prime (except for Juan Manuel Marquez). I thought his legs looked a little shaky against Cotto. At this stage of his career, Mayweather will have to become a "battling champion" and fight every time out, just like he did the first time he fought Jose Luis Castillo. By the way, I thought he lost that fight. I agree that Shane Mosley was an awesome fighter. He was very easy to like - a true champion in and out of the ring.
I just read your column, Canelo Is Mayweather's New Pacquiao. I have a question regarding the labeling of Floyd's Mayweather’s opponents as B+ fighters and his “selective matchmaking”. Obviously, you are entitled to your opinion. But to then say Manny Pacquiao regularly fought against the best available opposition is down right LAUGHABLE. He did fight regularly, however I for one, wouldn’t call them the best available. When Mayweather fought against 38 year old Shane Mosley, Mosley was considered a top P4P fighter by virtually everyone with a respected opinion, as well as one of the top 3 welterwightss in the world. Pacquiao fought Joshua Clottey, who just one fight prior, lost to Miguel Cotto... Pacquiao then goes on to fight Antonio Margarito, who mind you hadn’t had a “real fight” in almost two years, unless you count the glorified sparring match he had in Mexico, during his suspension. Margarito was KO’d by this same Mosley prior to fighting Pacquiao. Mayweather then fights a young Victor Ortiz, who beat an undefeated Andre Berto in the 2011 fight of the year. At that time behind Mayweather and Pacquiao, who was a better option at welterweight, since those two couldn’t make a fight?
Anyway, Pacquiao, a few months earlier, fights this same Mosley who is a year older, than when he fought Mayweather, and was winless in his 2 previous fights, before fighting the #1 pound-for-pound Pacquiao. Pacquiao then fights another old, almost 40 year old Juan Manuel Marquez, who they (Pacquiao Camp) thought was now too small for him as a welterweight. As for Miguel Cotto, who hadn’t lost in 3 years, wasn’t this the same Cotto who Pacquiao was trying to get him to fight at Welterweight, or at a catchweight for his June 2012 fight??? I give Pacquiao credit for Timothy Bradley, simply because he was young and undefeated. But Bradley was a junior welter, while Pacquiao was a welterweight. At some point doesn’t the #1 P4P guy have to fight the best guys in his own weight class? JMM and Bradley, were 2 consecutive fights against non-welterweights. I wonder what would be said about Mayweather, if he fought the best lightweight and junior welterweight in the world, in consecutive fights? If Mayweather’s opponents were a result of careful matchmaking, I would hate to see what you call Mayweather opponents, if he fought Clottey after losing to Cotto, Margarito after being KO’d by Mosley, and being inactive for almost 2 years, Mosley being WINLESS in his 2 previous fights, plus 39 years of age. The Lightweight Marquez at almost 40 years of age, whom his camp thought was now too small, due to Marquez’s previous venture as a Welterweight, and then Mayweather’s camp trying to fight Cotto at Welter, or a catchweight. LOL!! I have to believe that the words “best available opposition”, wouldn’t be used. As for Canelo being the new Pacquiao, I agree. But I have to wonder, what makes Canelo anymore worthy than Roberto Guerrero? Guerrero is getting his chance because of his big win against Berto. And now people are pushing for Canelo, after his big win against Austin Trout. Prior to Canelo beating Trout, I wouldn’t say his level of opposition, would warrant such a fight. Thanks for your time-- RD
Linder’s Response: Pacquiao always fought the best available opponent. That doesn’t mean that he faced an A level guy every time out. If he couldn’t find a great fighter, then he settled for a good fighter. Oscar De La Hoya, Ricky Hatton, and Miguel Cotto were all fighters who at least half the public believed would beat Pacquiao. Joshua Clottey was also considered a tough test. He had just given Miguel Cotto a life and death fight, and some people even think that Clottey deserved the decision. What it comes down to is that Juan Manuel Marquez, Timothy Bradley, and Floyd Mayweather were Pacquiao’s biggest threats and he faced two out of the three. The only reason I criticize Floyd’s matchmaking is that he always picked an opponent who would make for a good promotion, but not an opponent who the true boxing fans wanted to see. The public demanded Pacquiao-Mayweather and I believe Floyd sabotaged any chance of it happening. That’s just my opinion, and if you don’t agree, I won’t hold it against you. I’m not saying that Mayweather has ducked Canelo at this point. But if Floyd beats Guerrero, Canelo is the obvious choice for his next fight. If Floyd instead faces someone else, it would reinforce the idea that he engages in selective matchmaking.
Who gives a flying f--k what y'all sorry ass at boxingtalk think bcuz this site is becoming less & less relevent. And the canelo that fought trout would get his ass handed to him on a platter by floyd & that would only give this piece of s#*t site something else negative to say such as canelo wasn't ready or to green for floyd to bn fighting. And for this pacquiao s*&t, he had his shot in the very first negoiation but his bitch ass punked out over a drug test but now talkin about taking a drug with marquez after he got knocked da F##K OUT! what a hypocrite he is, plus manny had his chance again last year in may but chose not to because arum claim he had a cut over the eye that would take a half of year to heal but yet when they thought floyd was going to jail in may he wanted that date for marquez & manny but once they realize floyd wasn't going to jail all excuse start flying from manny eye needing to heal to building a bigger statium to manny couldn't fight until june when they knew floyd was going to jail so f--k off with this ducking manny shit because floyd would've knock his off balance ass out quicker than marquez did with a check left hook or soon as he jumped his dumb ass off his feet with a straight right hand like marquez did. Also stop talking about the last few guys floyd fought what about all the f&^kn lightweights manny & canelo being fighting & yes floyd don't have nothing else to prove this man being fighting for 17 yrs & stay undefeated in da process & has earn his right to fight whoever he wanna fight & no floyd dont have to move up to fight canelo flatfooted, no stamina having ass at 154 if he don't want to bcuz if canelo want floyd as bad as he say he do then bring his ass to 147 where the p4p king is at plus floyd is 36 yrs old & shouldn't keep going up & down in weight just to please u bitches let canelo young ass come down in weight bcuz it want effect him as much as it will with floyd, so shame on you & all the rest of you haters who just want to see floyd lose before he retire but quess what, yall will never get that opportunity.
Linder's Response: Your e-mail came about 20 minutes after this article was posted, so you must read Boxingtalk with regularity. We appreciate that. I think Floyd ducked Manny, but that's just my opinion. It's also the opinion of a lot of other people in the game. In fact, he'll probably be remembered more for ducking Manny than he will for all of the great things he's done inside the ring, and that's a shame. I have no interest in seeing Floyd lose. I have no interest in seeing him at all unless he's willing to face the best available competition. If Floyd fought Canelo and beat him, which I believe he's capable of, I would give him full credit. But I will not give him credit for something he hasn't done.
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